REAL ending, was:Re: [EVA] Final Genesis (SPOILERS)

[Robert Day]

MugenHunter, quoting Christopher Michael Bourke <cbourke1 at bigred.unl.edu>
 (I think - include some attribution guys !)
> >Shinji wants to be happy (and realizes it in 25-26) but ultimately
> >doesn't get it--how are these opposed?
> 
> That is your interpretation. Shinji became instrumentalitized in the Tv 
> ending. He smiled! He was happy!
> 
> Movie ending he saw that he COULD become happy.
> 
> The possibility, and the being are different.

The TV ending does not, in any way, explicitly demonstrate that Shinji chose 
Instrumentality/Complementation.  Note I say "TV ending".  This is your 
personal POV (to quote Ebj).
See below for my arguments against this interpretation.

> >The TV ending doesn't imply that he chose one way or the other,
> >only that he gained the knowledge he needed to make an informed
> >decision.
> 
> S-u-r-e. The place where he was when he was making the decision collapsed, 
> and he ends up in a bright unworldly place being congratulated by the cast, 
> presumably for making a choice. The imagery involved strongly suggest that 
> he chose instrumentality.

I disagree.  Instrumentality/Complementation is described several times as a 
merging of all Humanity into a single entity.  The final scene shows clearly 
that individual identities are preserved.  Can you demonstrate any line/scene 
in the series where it tells us individuality is preserved, rather than 
dissolved?

As to it being a bright unworldly place, that is just in contrast to the 
dark, unworldly place he is in just before.  The whole final scene is even 
more allegorical than the rest of the series.  I agree the change implies a 
choice was made, but not that it indicates a choice for Complementation.

<snip debate about relevance of RCB>
< and slightly re-arrange MugenHunter's original points to put my protracted 
rant at the end where it is easier to ignore...>

> >That's because, though Shinji has still chosen to face reality
> 
> He doesn't face reality in the TV ending. He makes a new one (Alternate 
> world) and escapes. In the movie he faces reality.
> 

However,  the imagery does not show Shinji in that Alternate world after 
making a choice.  Not the one with Rei's panties nor the Allegro non Troppo 
style limbo.
I agree the place where he "is" changes significantly when he makes his 
choice, but not to one of the Alternate worlds we have seen.

> >He is not one with the instrumentalized.  He is merely enlightened.
> 
> He IS one of the Instrumentalitized. See Episode 26 Filmbook notes: 
> "Shinji's smile is because he is one of the instrumentalitized."

This is interesting, and I wonder who's interpretation this is.  I have not 
read this book, so please give us some context and background, if you can.


What I will say, is that post hoc analysis of the TV series is a tricky 
thing.  The series was made and shown as it is; the feelings and thoughts we 
experienced having gone through the series and viewed the ending are what 
they are.   If we add or change information later, based on different 
sources, then the interpretation can change.  But that does not make the 
original interpretation invalid; it is still valid within the context of the 
original TV series.

Allow me to postulate (as if you can stop me ;-) :
Director Anno creates a series, with a certain ending.
The fans scream about it, sending hate mail etc.
Director Anno responds "Right, you ungrateful bastards.  I bared my soul for 
you and *this* is the thanks I get... Take THIS!" and produces a movie ...
with a different ending.

Is the first ending now invalid ?  Or changed ?
Is it changed by someone (even Director Anno) writing in a filmbook after the 
change of heart ?

In a scientific investigation, certainly it does.  New interpretations 
replace old regularly as more data is assimilated.  But, in literary 
criticism the same is not true.  The original text represents something that 
was true when it was produced.  Later versions, different truths.  All can be 
equally true, and more or less relevant, depending on the individual.  
Certainly Director Anno himself has said this, that both endings are true (I 
forget the citation, but I suspect it's in the archives here).

> MugenHunter! "They are different!"

Rob.  "But some are more different than others (and possibly equally valid)"


robday at cyllene.uwa.edu.au

Accept the possibility of all things,
and the certainty of none.